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Author Topic: How far do you take freedom of speech?  (Read 7718 times)
Saveyna Moonshadow
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« on: August 29, 2010, 10:36:49 AM »

Title says it all. For example, the BNP. A bunch of clowns, and I don't agree with what they say.

Many believe they should not have been given a chance to speak. I believe that they need equal rights despite their beliefs being what I percieve as idiotic, because persecuting them for believing something... well, although what they say is, I believe, wrong, 'wrong' is a matter of perception. And there would be uproar if someone tried to stop a priest from preaching his religion. They made fools out of themselves anyway when they talked, so...

What I'm trying to say is, I guess, is that who's to decide what's right and wrong? When do you take away the right to free speech.... and who's to decide it? Who has the right to force someone into silence? If someone has radical beliefs, and a person is fooled into the same ideas, then as long as the majority stay sceptical... I don't know. I'd welcome thoughts, ideas and debate on this one.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2010, 11:05:26 AM by Saveyna Moonshadow » Logged

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Mooie
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« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2010, 10:43:26 AM »

Doesn't freedom of speech also count as bullying at times o:
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Saveyna Moonshadow
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« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2010, 10:57:35 AM »

If it's an opinion being expressed, however callously and unpleasantly, then surely the right to free speech covers it. If it's just someone ordering some other person around nastily, then that's bullying.
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lucky thirteen
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« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2010, 11:01:59 AM »

Lol. the bnp... XD i haven't read the rest of the post yet- the need to laugh at nick griffin was to overwhelming. did you see when he was slagging someone off and they hit him to the ground? lol what a nunchuck!
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Saveyna Moonshadow
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« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2010, 11:05:46 AM »

Um... it's a start I suppose? Lol.
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lucky thirteen
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« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2010, 04:42:59 AM »

Um i don't know about the bullying- we have laws against discrimination, and although it doesn't stop it completely, the thought of being sued, i'm sure, is a deterent for the majority of people... so in this case perhaps it's not such a great thing?

also in the case of the watershed, which in my opinion is nearly nonexistiantial now... if we just allow tv programming containing inappropriate language to be shown at a time of day when it's easily accessible to children and able to negatively influence them... that's bad too.

it can cause riots, and wars....

but it's still better than living in a world where your whole life is controlled by the person in power....

isn't it???
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Thrystal Encantatore
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« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2010, 08:16:39 AM »

Neither of the two is good, for me.

Anyway, I believe 'freedom of speech' should be limited when the statements to be spoken are irrational. I remember questioning our old Speech teacher about the 'landslide' of our grades and she couldn't give me a good, straight reason...
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Saveyna Moonshadow
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« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2010, 08:57:09 AM »

What exactly constitutes an irrational statement though? That is what I am asking. Would you examine each case individually or pen a form of blanket law, which lists exactly what irrational statements consist of? Others would surely disagree with your opinions though. Because it's down to everyone to individually decide what is right and wrong, rational or irrational. It is perception! Always comes down to how you see the world.
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Thrystal Encantatore
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« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2010, 08:50:27 AM »

A statement is irrational if the statement goes beyond commonly accepted reasons. xD Sometimes, to be rational is to be sensible. Yes, it is down to the individual to decide but it is never down to the individual to decide what is right and wrong in the world. It always comes down to everyone. That is what I'm trying to say. What is generally right and wrong isn't determined by a single person, but by several persons. It is what people agree to.
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joegt123
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« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2010, 11:40:19 AM »

If a statement was termed "irrational" by the majority, then we'd still be primative compared to where we are now.

When everyone thought the world was flat, the discovery that it wasn't was "irrational". When everyone thought the world was the center of the univers, the discovery that the sun, in fat, was, was irrational. So irrational, in fact, that they almost put that man to death. They put him under house arrest instead.

Irrationality cannot be determined by "commonly accepted reason" or nothing will ever progress.

And that's about all I'm going to say about that.
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Saveyna Moonshadow
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« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2010, 01:00:18 PM »

Don't be stubborn. It's a debate. So is most of the philosophy section. When you post there, people will challenge your views. And it's fun to reply.

Opposing human rights: Freedom of speech versus the right not to be offended. Let's say I started insulting a well known celebrity on t.v. This celebrity is on drugs. I, tactlessly, call them a druggy. That statement is not irrational since it is fact. Now, I have the right to state my opinion. He/she has the right not to be offended. There would be uproar from the public. But surely, in theory, it is my right. Have I done something wrong? What do you think?
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mage master
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« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2010, 09:50:05 PM »

freedom of speech id say is determined by a culturals 'norms'. like you could say something in england no one would bat an eyelid and likely agree with you but if you sayd it in (lets say) china, there would be an uproar and youd likely be offending alot of people

basically the unwritten laws of society determine the limitations of freedom of speech.

however if a person is radical in there thinking then id say yes they are entitled to there opinion. but what realy gets on my nerves is people preaching the 'gospel' in the likes of town centres. i always think fair enough many other people accept this but to me its like your trying to ram your beliefs down peoples throats. but within our society this is the norm and is an acceptible means of freedom of speach.
however if i got up and sayd my opinions many people would be offended/pissed off, rather than a handful of folk.

being ofended realy boils down to the persons perseption of the statement. i.e. you call someone weird and they take it as a compliment, where as you go to the next person and they get all offended about it.
so therefore it isnt just the 'norms' within a society that determaine the extent of freedom of speech but it is also determined by the individuals perseption of what is being sayd.
its often a case of the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few
*end of ramble lol*
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Thrystal Encantatore
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« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2010, 10:05:16 AM »

If a statement was termed "irrational" by the majority, then we'd still be primative compared to where we are now.

When everyone thought the world was flat, the discovery that it wasn't was "irrational". When everyone thought the world was the center of the univers, the discovery that the sun, in fat, was, was irrational. So irrational, in fact, that they almost put that man to death. They put him under house arrest instead.

Irrationality cannot be determined by "commonly accepted reason" or nothing will ever progress.

And that's about all I'm going to say about that.

Discoveries are not irrational (duh. Peace xD). Discoveries are based on facts, not just made-up opinions. Therefore, they are not irrational. Smiley
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joegt123
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« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2010, 10:18:23 AM »

Yes, but back then, it couldn't yet be proven. Hell, until we went into space we couldn't be ABSOLUTELY sure that we revolved around the sun. So it was as good as an opinion hundreds or thousands of years ago. Same principle, I think.
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Remember the golden rule of religion: "I am right, you are wrong." Doesn't matter who says it or what they believe. No one can prove anything, anyway.
Thrystal Encantatore
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« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2010, 10:20:52 AM »

They couldn't have accepted it if it wasn't proven then. xD It may have still been irrational for them until they accepted it.
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